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Post by paarthurnax on Oct 16, 2014 21:07:52 GMT
So, it seemed that at least there was someone that could understand that Digimon that had just come inside the building. Tatsuya pulled his D-3 with a hum, and pointed it at the unknown newcomer, a species he had never seen before. His device was quick as always, providing him with information about the creature, although it was much more scarce than compared to other times, maybe due to the fact that it was an uncommon Digimon. -A Ranamon, huh... -he muttered, storing the electronic device once more as he listened more carefully to her words. -Hey, I don't like to be so formal, so colloquiallisms are my way of speaking, just as yours seem to be too formal, at least for my taste. So I guess we could as well call it a draw? -he replied while looking at her with his indigo eyes. Then the conversation shifted its course as the heavy rain suddenly stopped. The young man shrugged: weather and climate could shift with relative ease in the Digital World, so that phenomenom could be regarded as normal. Then Avery showed him both her crests. The teen smiled as he looked at her. -Wow, that's great! Which traits do they represent? -he asked, curious, as he also showed her his own. -As far as I know, they represent both Determination and Freedom... I guess they define me very accurately -he said with a slight grin, although when she replied to her previous comment about her not being angry, she apologized to him. -Sorry, it's just...that if I thought someone had hurt Patch. Well it pisses me off! -the fifteen year old girl said with a little bit of sadness in her voice. Tatsuya smiled warmly at her, his gaze comforting as always. -Ave, you don't need to apologize for that, ya know. If it was me, I would also get angry if anyone made my partner hurt... that's why I don't have interest in this Swanmon, but rather, the one Dorumon had the displeasure of meeting -the teen's expression suddenly darkened for an instant, before returning to its usual state. -Just give it a rest! You gain nothing from getting angry at something that hasn't even happen, so as I said, relax! We're among friends now, so nobody will get hurt.As he finished speaking to the young italian girl, he gently ruffled her hair once more with a sincere smile. At that moment, however, the other Swanmon would ask him something. - I am not the previous swannmon and I cannot ease her mistakes. But maybe I can make a small compensation. As Dorumon's tamer, you have power over his evoltuions and know him better than anyone, so I'll ask you: would your partner like to spend a day in day are, a way to make up fir the lost timeduring a day?A loud growl then came from the Dorumon. -No, thanks. I rather spend as little time as possible in here, Swanmon -he almost spat the words, and then grinned in a sinister way. -Compensation? Oh, but the village already gave me a great gift when I left, though none of you here seem to have realized. Still, it's none of your business. I was literally kicked out of here once, and I've got no plans on staying here for long -the Rookie said, his voice cold as ice. Tatsuya sighed, looking at the Swanmon. -Well, you heard him. We definately won't leave now, but he's made his choice. Also, just so you know... I don't have any power over him. Dorumon is free to leave when he feels like it. I don't own him; we are friends, so I'm not forcing him to do what he doesn't want to do -the teen said, with Dorumon looking at him with a smile. When his Tamer talked in that way, it made him feel proud of being his Digimon partner.
OOC: The design isn't mine tho
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Post by elsonoshradder on Oct 21, 2014 21:03:02 GMT
"She says that her way of speaking is not being forced, it's actual way of speaking and that her name is "Vetina"." Tinkermon translated. She grabbed one of the babies, as it tried to climb up her spear. "Isn't it cute?"
Elson facepalmed before leaving the hut, as Tatsuya and A.J. began a conversation on crests, a tamer-exclusive as far as Elson was given to know. Outside, Vetina complained about something, but given Tinkermon was still inside the hut, they had no way to understand the digimon.
"Oh, just quit complaining." Silversteamdramon complained back. "So my general what is it that we are to do here?"
For a moment, Elson stopped and looked at his digimon, pensative. Truth was Dorumon's story, even if it was only a fraction, had given him a lot to think about. Was he willing to fight? Always? For what? So far the digital world had provided quite a deal of threats and fights, but should he try to seek them himself?
Meaningwhile, inside the hut, Swannmon looked down to Dorumon, sad.
"I'm sorry to hear that, I really am. I would like to give you something to try to make a little for all the horrors those monsters must have done to you, but if you don't want it, or don't trust me enough to take my offer, then I understand." The swan digimon told him "I guess, I'll be handling the babies then, I can't force Tinkermon to do ALL the work for me, can I?"
"Oh please, it's no touble at all, I love working with babies!" Tinkermon replied with a smile, which was quick to spread to the Swannmon.
Outside, Elson answered Silversteamdramon
"I need to ask, Silversteamdramon. Why do we fight? What's the point?" Elson asked.
"So we can get better at it, my general." Silversteamdramon replied
"But to what end?" Elson insisted.
"Give me a bit my general." Silversteamdramon requested, pensative and confused.
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Post by Palmon, The Vetina on Oct 21, 2014 21:27:41 GMT
Vetina paid little attention to the digimon who told her to quit complaining. Not like the guy understood her. And she was part aquatic digimon, she had every right to complain about lack of rain.
Anyway, she heard Elson having concerns over his purpose here. Why did he fight, he wondered. The Ranamon chuckled, getting comfy in her water chair as she leaned to the side, supporting her chin with her hand.
"Fight for better fighting seems almost a platitude. Even at my own expense, I say it's too trite a state to maintain. If your story has no concrete end, nor even a simple state of being to enter, why take arms? 'To get better' is a season; salt to a meal. By no means does it provide sustinance alone.
Your general cannot act as such, strung along with a nothing lure. It's okay to be lost. Find the end together, but don't whisper sweet nothing nothings for temporary ease and sustaining issue.
And snap back again to your dousing, by the by."
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Post by A.J. Cipriano on Oct 22, 2014 0:21:33 GMT
I'm shedding Shedding every color Trying to find a pigment of truth Beneath my skin
AJ listened intently as Tatsuya explained what both of his crests represented. "Determination and Freedom, hmm? Yes, I would definitely say those describe you very accurately," she said, teasing the older boy. They seemed to be developing that older-brother-younger-sister kind of relationship and she was glad to have someone to call a friend.
AJ's eyes clouded for a moment when asked what hers represented, but she smiled quickly. "The one on the right represents faith and the one on the left...well it represents wrath. I know it sounds kind of dark, but...Patch gets really powerful. But we don't use it very much..." her voice dropped down slightly and her icy gaze slipped to Elson, conversing with Silversteamdramon.
That really got her thinking. Why did she and Patch fight? During the first half of their relationship, she had fought and fought to keep him from fighting, but he had ended up throwing himself on the front line for her so many times. She cast a quick smile down at her partner, who just returned it with a tilt of his head.
When she heard Vetina start to speak again, she blinked. "Uhm, anyone care to translate again?"
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Post by paarthurnax on Oct 22, 2014 13:15:09 GMT
Tatsuya smirked at the italian girl when she acknowledged that the crests did suit him indeed. He was about to ask her about her own, but she then told him a little about hers, as if she had read his mind. -The one on the right represents faith and the one on the left...well it represents wrath. I know it sounds kind of dark, but...Patch gets really powerful. But we don't use it very much... -AJ said, not very convinced. The teen quirked an eyebrow, stranged.
-Well, I can understand that bit about faith, but... wrath? I can't even imagine you being angry! -the young man told her, his mind quickly working on an image about her being enraged, but everything that came to mind was Avery pouting at him, making him laugh for a second. -Nope, definitely not, Ave! Though if you say it, I guess I'll have to believe you -he finished, smirking. Dorumon looked at the Swanmon, awaiting for the bird Digimon's answer to his rejection.
-Exactly. Save that crap for all the newborns... by the way, if it ever comes to my ears that an X-Antibody has been kicked out of the village again... Well, I suppose you know what would happen. Either way, that's going too far ahead in the future -the Rookie warned the Swanmon, not willing to let the same thing happen to another Digimon such as himself. The Kazan then stretched, looking at everyone.
-Ahh, don't worry, man! I'm sure this Swanmon means no harm to any of the babies. However, let her and Tinkermon take care of them. If me or my partner were to do it, I'm sure we'd screw everything up! -he stated, obviously joking, but also with a little truth in that sentence. He didn't think he was good for taking care of a baby, specially a Digimon one. With Dodomon it had been different, though that could've been because he seemed much more self-reliant than those Fresh Digimon.
Outside, Elson questioned Silversteamdramon why did they fight. Now that Tatsuya thought about it, they did have an objective in mind: freedom for his partner. However, he was quite curious about the others. -Say, Ave, why do you fight alongside Patch?
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Post by elsonoshradder on Oct 23, 2014 19:30:52 GMT
Inside the hut, Swannmon got herself to work. She was sad that dorumon had refused her offer, but there should be no problem.
" Grownups make their own decisions." She reminded herself as she got to work. Picking a bottle to feed one of the babies she smiled towards Tinkermon who was once more trying to feed more than one at once. "You should only feed one at a time. They want your love, not just the food. How will they grow into strong, brave digimon if we don't cherish them?"
" But they're all so cute!" Tinkermon complained. "I guess you're right... Let me finish this ones and I'll do better with next ones, I promise."
"Thank you, Tinkermon. I haven't had any help from anybody for a while, Cherrymon is too big for this hut and the babies are...well, babies. Togemon could lend a hand, but her hands aren't suited for handling them either." The Swannmon repsonded "Say, wouldn't like to work here full time, like me? You seem to really like babies, not fighting like Dorumon or Silversteamdramon seem to enjoy."
Tinkermon became thoughtfull on the matter. Indeed, maybe it would be right for her to leave Elson's army and join Swannmon in her work, forfillibg her dream to be a full-time careatker to a whole village of babies, maybe more.
Meaningwhile, outside, Elson and Silversteamdramon were immersed in they're discussion and Vetina gave them an opinion. They barely understood it, but it seemed she was saying " fighting for the sake of fighting is bad" or something along those lines. Tatsuya and Avery arrived with their partners, with the first asking the second about THEIR motives for figthing.
Silversteamdramon was pondering on what to tell Elson.
"Well, revenge isn't really my thing. Fighting for it seems...like once you achieve something like that, you're pointless. There's not even a guarantee you'll be happy about it. Getting better might to prove you're superior is utter suicide: you'll eventually run into someone that is better than you, and not taking defeat isn't a good idea at that point. Maybe for the sake of improving you own self?" Silversteamdramon commented.
"That's vague. You can never achieve it or say you were close, cause you don't know your maximum limits. There's no such thing as perfection. This makes it pointless to fight to improve yourself." Elson replied, disappointed about the answers he was getting. Sensing this, Silversteamdramon turned to Vetina and the two other humans.
"How about you three? Why do YOU fight? What about your partners, for those who have them?" The machine inquired.
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Post by Palmon, The Vetina on Oct 23, 2014 20:04:15 GMT
"Translate, translate, that oft implied or stated rebuttal. I can affirm my metaphoric tongue is a... condition, but grow an ear for context. Even a baggy fit of understanding would be of worth."
After Vetina said that to AJ, in an annoyed but not really angry tone, she rubbed her temples a bit. Vetina was not going to speak a couple words at a time. It was annoying, a tad difficult, and frankly made her sound idiotic, she felt.
After hearing the others speak, Vetina, among a couple others, were asked why they fight. However, this was not a particularly hard question for her.
"You inquire 'why', but the truth is that form of inquiry is of little application to me.
It is a trait. One inculcated onto me from youth onward. I admit, back in those youthful years I groped for power. A simple goal for a simple mindset. It's it's a long discarded 'reason', however. It's a nature, a section of my being.
My current life has no real, 'I fight, because...'. If choices are given, one answer is fighting; a response. Any ends I see and can grab, be it personal betterment, personal enjoyment, personal protection, or aid to one I deem is worthy, combat is my reliable response, not my means.
But I wonder if my reasoning has ran off from you."
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Post by A.J. Cipriano on Oct 24, 2014 16:55:35 GMT
I'm shedding Shedding every color Trying to find a pigment of truth Beneath my skin
-Well, I can understand that bit about faith, but... wrath? I can't even imagine you being angry!-
AJ laughed softly. "Yeah, I mean...I'm not really an angry person, but..." she trailed off for a moment, gray-blue orbs darkening to a more stormy affect as she thought about it. All the moving, all the years of losing people. Her fists tightened again, but she released them quickly She smiled again at Tatsuya, and shrugged. "I guess it was given to me for a reason."
When asked by Tatsuya why she and Patch fought, a smirk tipped on her lips. It was almost like he head read her mind. And then Silversteamdramon was asking pretty much the same question. "Well, at first I didn't want him to. I was afraid of losing him, but now I realize its a part of who he was. At first, it was to protect me. But we fight because we're a team."
She frowned slightly at the annoyance in Vetina's tone, even thought it wasn't angry. She shrugged and offered the Ranamon a smile. "Sorry for not undestanding. I speak four languages, but your dialect is a little strange to me. I'll try to comprehend a little more. Is our way of speaking strange to you?" she inquired.
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Post by paarthurnax on Oct 24, 2014 20:10:56 GMT
Tatsuya listened to Ave's words about her opinion on the crest of Wrath. So she wasn't an angry person, but there had to be a reason why she posessed the digital item. With a shrug, the teen smirked at the girl with yet another playful comment. -So, I should really watch out, right? I'm sure you're scary when you're angered, Ave! -he said with a wide grin, obviously messing with her. As for why she fought, it was because the fifteen year old fought alongside Patch because they were both part of the same team.
As Vetina began saying another long-winded speech about her reasons to fight, despite her not considering to even have one; instead, it was something like a choice, or that was what Tatsuya could discern from all her sentences. It was a response, an answer, not a means of anything, which got him into thinking. Dorumon snorted while quirking an eyebrow. -"Oh, for fuck's sake, not another one like Ayaka... " -the Rookie thought, turning his attention to SilverSteamdramon's question about why did they fight.
Almost instantly, a rush of desultory memories flooded his mind, making his eyes widen for a second as they gained a much more feral appearence. Tatsuya looked at him, concerned. Each day that passed, the memories kept creeping up thanks to Hypnomon... but was that really something that they had under control? After all, the last time that something similar happened to Dorumon...
He shook his head, trying to get those thoughts out of his mind. The Rookie Digimon then spoke, his eyes fixed on the Swanmon. A loud growl came from its mouth before speaking. -I'll wipe them out... cut them from this world... -it began, but Tatsuya quickly shot him a deadly gaze. -Dorumon. Get a hold of yourself -he said, in a serious tone so different to his usual carefree voice.
The Digimon seemed to look surprised, as if he hadn't been the one to say that. After clearing its throat, it began again. -In this world, the strongest rule. It has always been like that. I don't want to live in fear of anything again, so I fight to become stronger... and be completely free someday. That is my goal -the Digimon said, now more akin to his usual personality.
-"This is bad..." -Tatsuya thought.
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Post by elsonoshradder on Oct 28, 2014 20:00:15 GMT
Tinkermon was still pondering on Swannmon`s question. She was so emmersed in thoughts in fact, that she failed to notice about five babies crawling their way up her back, Maybe she should stay? But then again, what would Elson think, after taking her as part of his team, after going specifically after her and taking out of her loneliness, a loneliness she had been a victim of ever since she and Petermon had had that big fight of theirs. It was so confsuing for her, yet she knew she`d have to make that decision on that day, before leaving that hut. she couldn`t ask Elson, much less Silversteamdramon or Drimogemon. It was up to her to choose who she´d work for from that day on...
Elson and Silversteamdramon had their own questions to handle. The first to speak was Vetina, in her usual difficult to understand speech form. With great effort, Silversteamdramon tried to interpret her.
"I think she just said she doesn`t fight for a reason, but rather a response to a certain situation. That she used to crave power, fight for it, but no more." Silversteamdramon commented.
"What? Fighting without a reason is the very reason why I even began to ask about it. To have no true goal when you fight is to have no merit in it, and you`d be better of running then, not risking your life to it." Elson replied A.J said something about them being a team, about it being part of who her partner was. "So, digimon are just fighting machines? We`re here to what, make them better at killing each other, so the others can be reborn and start this crazy cycle all over? Isn`t that...pointless?"
"But maybe, there is a reason she fights, but she doesn`t know it yet, like you and I, my general. As for your question on the purpouse of digimon being fighting...I don`t know, I think it isn`t, since digimon have other goals too, but... I never saw a digimon who never fought or ended up fighting some day of his or her life, except for those who are yet too young to have done so." Silversteamdramon explained.
"So all digimon fight, except those who are young? Hm... Is it about proving something?" Elson inquired.
At that point, Dorumon gave his answer to the fighting problem, a sort of aggressive tone in his speech. Silversteamdramon, reach out to his sword, without drawing it yet, but hed be ready in any case.
"Freedoom through power? I wouldn`t say that. I heard of many strong digimon, bound to chains due to their own power, some dying because of it. No, power on its own its useless if you can`t keep in check how others perceive you having it."Silversteamdramon stated.
"I guess we`re starting to get somewhere. I`m guessing that one should fight to obtain power, to train. But also to prove something,to porve one is the way one would like to be seen by others. Question is... What do you want others to see you as? A dictator? Someone powerful? Someone kind? A liberator? An ally?"
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Post by Palmon, The Vetina on Oct 28, 2014 21:11:09 GMT
AJ replied back, stating that she didn't understand Vetina's dialect (as most everyone could attest to), and asked whether their speech sounded weird to her. This... didn't help Vetina's mood. But she took a deep breath, removed her helmet, revealing pink hair, and reclined more on her water chair. It's times like these she understood how lonely the original Vetina could get. Although the current Vetina wasn't, shall we say, occasionally homicidal.
"Okay, I will queue up brief statements now. With slow, fragmentented phrases I can properly deliver a context more in tune to your usual comprehension.
I had. A severe. Mind shattering. Mental breakdown. So I. Talk weird. At length. I cannot. Help it. Most times."
Each phrase was emphasized, made clear enough for everyone to hear, with ample pausing. It wasn't a topic she wanted to openly talk about, and as of now only her friend Betty and some weird belching Gabumon named Rippah knew her full story. Granted, Vetina would not want to get rid of it, even if she could. No, she still held on tight to that memory of the original Vetina.
Anyway, Vetina paid little mind to the Dorumon's outburst, as it seemed like the standard way some digimon thought, and she was in no mood to argue points. Especially since trying it reminded her of Beverly, who was far more vocal in her distaste for power for the sake of power.
But then Sliversteamdramon made the claim that Vetina probably had a reason to fight that she just doesn't know yet. She spoke sternly, but she was getting a tad peeved again.
"I gave you my 'reason', don't waive it aside as ignorance towards myself. My reason *is* a lack thereof. Don't read a mere page of me and then recite to it's subject false and baseless conjecture.
You... none of you need my full details. No, the information is a private crevasse of my being. But I shall repeat, I will partake in combat as a response. I've been trained as such. And I've learned to live as such. Do not waive validity from my words."
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Post by A.J. Cipriano on Oct 29, 2014 0:09:35 GMT
I'm shedding Shedding every color Trying to find a pigment of truth Beneath my skin
When Tatsuya continued to tease her, saying she was probably scary when angry, she just laughed. "Oh yes, I'm quite the scare," she said, laughing again. Her laughter was caught off guard when Dorumon growled, seeming to revert back into his primal state.
'Poor little guy...' she thought, but she knew better than to say those words out loud since last time she had said that, he had forced himself way too hard when fighting Patch and Dracomon.
"What? Fighting without a reason is the very reason why I even began to ask about it. To have no true goal when you fight is to have no merit in it, and you`d be better of running then, not risking your life to it. So, digimon are just fighting machines? We`re here to what, make them better at killing each other, so the others can be reborn and start this crazy cycle all over? Isn`t that...pointless?"
The Italian teen's lip curled slightly as she frowned. "No, I didn't say he was a fighting machine, did I? When we first met, I didn't want him to fight, but he had to a few times to save my life. I've realized that that's why he's here. He's here to protect me. That's even what he told me. I've watched him fight for about four months. There is something about him that enjoys it. If he enjoys it and I know he's going to be okay, I'll let him, but I'll fight with him. But if he wants to rest, I'll let him rest."
Vetina clearly explained with much emphasis the reason for why she spoke the way she did. AJ tilted her head, eyebrows furrowing in concern. "I'm sorry. I'll try to understand you a little better. I'm from Italy and we say things differently sometimes that people in Japan don't say, so I think I can understand kind of," she said, offering the pink-haired Digimon a smile.
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Post by paarthurnax on Oct 29, 2014 19:17:24 GMT
Dorumon looked at SilverSteamdramon as it got on the offensive. What was he doing? Was he scared about his comment, or what? The Rookie didn't say anything about it, though, for the little dragon had begun talking once again. -Freedoom through power? I wouldn`t say that. I heard of many strong digimon, bound to chains due to their own power, some dying because of it. No, power on its own its useless if you can`t keep in check how others perceive you having it -Elson's partner explained, making Tatsuya's partner chuckle in a sarcastic way.
It was very funny, the Digimon might be much harsher, but in essence, its way of thinking was similar to Mana's partner. When it spoke, he took a step forward to the artificial version of Steamdramon. -So you're trying to tell me that in a world that follows the law of the jungle, freedom isn't attainable through power? What, you'd think becoming stronger would pin me down...? If that's the case, let me ask you something. What is better? To feel powerless, knowing that you can't do anything by yourself, and live in fear, being conscious that if the rulers wanted to, they could erase your existance with a finger?
I don't think so. Not me. I'll get stronger, much stronger than what I'm currently capable of now. Then, nobody will be able to cut my freedom anymore, unless they want to get badly injured, that is. When I truly become strong... that's the time I'll be free. Dying because of my power? I would gladly die a hundred times if I could break free of this world's laws. Why do you think I was forced to leave this village? It's just a vague memory, but... I was threatened, and I was too weak to do anything -the Digimon finished the long speech, so unusual in his persona.
Tatsuya then looked at Elson's partner with curious eyes. -I don't know if you're right or not, but that's why we fight for. Heck, that's why we're even together in the first place. Dorumon knows that the moment he doesn't need me anymore, he's free to go. I won't chain him down, or force him to stay... otherwise, I'd become like what he's trying to fight against -the teen confessed, but then another question ensued.
-I don't care what other people think of me. I just want to be free, that's all -both partner and Digimon said in unison, then looked at each other. They were really alike in the way they thought, even if they had their differences.
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Post by elsonoshradder on Oct 30, 2014 1:52:51 GMT
So hard...to decide. Tinkermon didn't even notice the the babies climbing her, looking like some cute yet macabre coat, so desperatly trying to figure the choice to make. Maybe by looking into her past she might make a good decision? But what other big decision did she make before? Of course: the time she and Petermon fought. What was it about? Respect for the babies. Tinkermon knew what she had to chose. She wouldn't be ungratefull and dishonest and a coward by staying behind and leaving Elson. No, there would always be babies around. But she at the very least owned Elson to be in his team. She make this babies proud of having been fed by her.
Meaningwhile, Elson and Silversteamdramon had listened to the other opinions.
"Well, I don't know. If I wanted safety and had my digimon around to protect me...I might as well run. No offense to you, but if I did everything for my saftey I'd be a coward and wouldn't be in this world in the first place. My fighting can't be about mere protection." Elson relied to A.J.. He then heard Vetina's explanation on her speaking patterns and felt...pity for her. "I hope you get bbetter soon, Vetina. I wish you the best of lucks."
"Me too." Silversteamdramon added "And Tatsuya and Dorumon, I'd rather be a living, well reputated slave than a free brute. Freedoom is good, but it is worth nothing alone...afteralk once you get it, you still have to find a proper way to apply it. And I assure you, you don't need freedo for most ways to apply it. But it get's us to something else: how does one's view on us really affect us?"
"My dad once told me that to get rid of the bullies I had to prove to them I could always beat them. I don't think it has to do with making them afraid...or at least not just that, a way of showingoff my power to attain freedoom as I think Dorumon would say. I think it may have to do with another type of mark. But what could it be?" Elson commented.
"Glory, my general. Being remembered by your feats." Silversteamdramon answered
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Post by Palmon, The Vetina on Oct 30, 2014 16:04:19 GMT
Well, at least there was an understanding as to why Vetina spoke the way she did, even if she didn't give the full reason. Indeed, she did have a mental breakdown. And it did cause her to speak this way. But there's a good deal more to it than that. In any case, Vetina remained silent this time as she listened to the others, sitting up in her water chair. At the moment she had nothing to really say. And she needed a moment to recollect herself.
Fighting for freedom of this cycle of being abused by those more powerful. Part of the reasoning was a bit confusing for Vetina, but it seemed like it was basically a minor variant of the standard "I want to be able to beat others up" in her mind. But what frame of reference did she even have? She never had the Dorumon's problem. She liked to be able to defend herself, or fight for those who need it, but she never put a rise to power as priority. No, if anything, she had a completely different final goal, one that seemed unattainable to her, but power had little to do with trying to get it.
Silversteam also mentioned something... being remembered for their feats. Well, if Vetina died and faded into obscurity, so be it. Even if this Vetina is meant to be a successor to the original, it's for her own selfish reasons to keep her memory alive, not for anyone else.
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